Why Kiwi Blokes Aren’t Getting it Right

One of the most common complaints I get from women is that kiwi males are missing the mark. That they just don’t pursue enough, aren’t putting enough effort in. To be honest, especially after dating a PILE of men during the research of Eighty Eight Dates, and then dating just because I liked it, I have to agree.

During my own experiences I’ve found that English, American and even Australian men tend to be a little more driven in their dating (though kiwi men are far more likely to try to get you into bed on the first date if they get that far)
I think that kiwi men are still stuck in the “She’ll be right” mentality when it comes to their dating life.But kiwi women have, for the most part, moved on from that mentality in every other area of their life. We have careers, are people in our own right, with active social lives, and while we love men, enjoy their company and love the idea of dating- it’s got to be a special man who’ll pull us away from all of that.

It is not enough to suggest a non specific catch up if you are interested in a girl guys. Us girls use the “I’ll pencil you in” excuse if we aren’t that keen to meet up with someone in a business or a friend context. So if a guy says it to us- that screams at us that really you are not that interested. In fact, we already pretty much assume most guys are not the best at commitment- and will really only ever commit to the girl they just can’t be without. If you’re struggling to commit to the first date, it’s speaking volumes to the girl about what they can expect in the future (as we expect any traits you have now will just become more extreme with time – once the best behaviour has worn off.)
If you’re a guy who keeps on trying the casual approach and finding it is just not getting the results you want…. here is a novel idea: ask a girl on a proper date. If she says no, which is really the worst case scenario, at least you’ve got a firm answer. But stop thinking “she’ll be right” and keeping it ultra casual. Us kiwi girls are pretty much over it. Right girls?

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12 Responses to “Why Kiwi Blokes Aren’t Getting it Right”


  1. 1 Nathaniel Flick July 12, 2009 at 12:39 am

    This is very interesting. Lots of guys in the states “play it cool” so to speak, especially the younger ones. Do you find it’s 80/20 here that do the same or just the ones at bars and on the “dating scene”?

    • 2 rgoodchild July 12, 2009 at 12:42 am

      The difference is that in the States women are far more likely to say it’s not on and move on. Women here are just confused and think the guy is just not interested. Guys here in the main try and get the girl to chase- and like it if the girl is quite proactive.
      It’s different than in the states I think where girls are told the guy has to pursue. And more of us kiwi girls expect the same thing- we are successful in our own lives- and need to know the guy is ballsy enough to cope with that right from the outset. Most men are not.

      • 3 Nathaniel Flick July 12, 2009 at 12:45 am

        I would agree that kiwi blokes are more aloof, but I don’t agree American women want to be chased or get confused less by aloof men: The younger ones love the “jerks” more often than not. It’s the whole “nice guy” thing.

  2. 4 rgoodchild July 12, 2009 at 12:47 am

    We all love a jerk- but there is a difference between a sexy, confident jerk, and a guy who won’t commit. the second sort? gets the boot. every time

    • 5 Nathaniel Flick July 12, 2009 at 12:52 am

      So if the guy is sexy you’ll put up with it? :)

      • 6 Nathaniel Flick July 12, 2009 at 12:55 am

        Not trying to be difficult, just not understanding the point…

      • 7 rgoodchild July 12, 2009 at 1:02 am

        Hmm, it’s more a sexy, confident guy (often called a player) knows how to play a certain type of dating game which makes the girl chase. but most men epically fail on it- and the best relaitonships aren’t borne out of it – because most of the time the attraction is bourne out of a needing to prove interest.
        it’s attractive however- just not life changingly worth of dating

  3. 8 Nathaniel Flick July 12, 2009 at 1:05 am

    Okay, this makes good sense actually. If the guy is a jerk, sexy, but still puts out the effort that wins every time over a guy who couldn’t give a toss.

    Aren’t there some kiwi blokes out there who are interested, interesting, and give a toss? (Guess that’s the point of your post, aye, the fact that they are few and far between.)

  4. 9 gary July 12, 2009 at 6:04 am

    What about what men have to go through, its far worse trying to figure out the female attraction triggers. If I ring her now will she think i’m desperate? if i’m too nice to her will she think i’m a wussy? if I act like I care too much she’ll think i’m needy!

    From a nice guy who has lost a couple of great women to real jerks i think i need to learn more about how not to give a shit, take it easy and not bother pursuing, because in the end, to me, it seems the majority (not all) of women LIKE to chase men and indeed the attractive ones, who are so used to being chased, will only really be attracted a man they believe they HAVE to chase.

    Women will always tell you what they want in a man, and its always similar qualities. But unfortunately i don’t believe attraction is a conscious choice. What they want and what they are actually attracted to are totally different. I came to the conclusion i was doing something wrong when i found out all the women i wasn;t really interested in seemed to like me a lot and the ones i was interested in, may have liked me intially because perhaps i met what they thought they wanted in a man, but because I lacked the real attraction triggers (which i’m yet to figure out) the relationahips subsequentlly ended. I’ve been trying the ‘casual approach’ for a while now, and its definitely going a lot better than other approaches i’ve tried!

    I do agree with you that Kiwi men are a little behind. But don’t think you’ve quite hit the nail on the head. Kiwi men seem to be far less confident or at least far less comfortable with being uncomfortable. The majority of kiwi males seem to want to hide behind a protective wall of alcohol induced courage before even approaching and talking to a women! I don’t think kiwi men are deliberately going for the casual approach or thinking “she’ll be right” I think they just don’t like the idea of an uncomfortable date because they aren’t confident in dealing with it. So you’re right in that men need to go out and date more, but it is pretty hard to build your confidence whilst trying to find that balance between attractive jerk and nice guy!

  5. 10 Elle Montgomery-Smith July 14, 2009 at 3:46 am

    Gary:

    Respectful reciprocity.

    If you’re making the effort and getting nothing back in return or you feel she has a sense of entitlement…. move on.
    If she’s contacting you and making the effort, stick around a while. If both of you are coming up with ideas of what to do and where to go then you’re both in it.

    Personally I don’t see myself as an up-myself Diva, I’m very down to earth and I can enjoy a good round of tea and bikkies at a cafe. The thought of a three course meal in a fancy restaurant gives me indigestion since it’s not how I live. If a guy is interested enough to ask how my day has been and tell me about his with a few giggles in between, I’m happy for the contact and shall return it often.

    I guess it comes down to whether the people involved value themselves and whether they get respect by how they act. I do, hence not putting up with shit treatment and rounds of silent treatment or being fobbed off because they’re too busy. the saying “nice guys always come last”… is crap. SAPS come last, puppy dog men who don’t value their inner self enough to stand up for themselves get respect. “Bad boys” who act like hormonally driven teenagers can kiss my backside, they don’t always get the good women… because the women of substance won’t take their crap. Sure, it’s fun for some women but in the end who wants a commitment phobic cad who spends his time avoiding others and coming up with ways to make a woman chase ALL the time? Smacks of ego boosting and massive insecurity to me. Nice guys are the tops.

  6. 11 Paul July 15, 2009 at 12:59 am

    Interesting points and I agree that (some) Kiwi guys are a bit too informal. That’s a product of our culture and it cuts both ways.

    I find it quite ironic that women seek parity with men in almost every other sphere of life, yet men are still expected to do the chasing.

    Anyway, I think women still need to let guys know they are at least interested. My experience has been that if she shows some interest then it is worth pursuing in a romantic way. The “thrill” of rejection wears off after a few times for most of us guys.

    On a humourous note, the last time I turned up at someone’s place with flowers in hand the (recently) departed ex-husband opened the door and greeted me cheerily. Soooo embarrasing…


  1. 1 The $25 date challenge « Eighty Eight Dates by Rachel Goodchild Trackback on July 14, 2009 at 12:37 am

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